Dr. Boyd Haley: “I seriously doubt Mr. Blaxill could shred [the Geiers'] research”

boyd haley

By Jake Crosby

Following a post on Autism Investigated in which then-board member of SafeMinds Mark Blaxill was quoted as having called Dr. Mark and David Geier’s work “sloppy,” Dr. Boyd Haley contacted Autism Investigated and weighed in on the matter. Blaxill also claimed in a 2003 email of the Geiers’ work, “…I could rip it to shreds.”

The Geiers – father and son scientists – have repeatedly published studies implicating the mercury-based vaccine preservative thimerosal in causing autism. Dr. Haley, whose email is below, is president of CTI Science, professor emeritus of chemistry from the University of Kentucky as well as a world-renowned expert on mercury toxicity.

This is what Dr. Haley had to say about Mark Blaxill’s remarks concerning the Geiers:

I know both Mark Blaxill and Mark & David Geier fairly well. Mr. Blaxill does not have the biological science and medical training of the Geier’s and most of their articles address issues on the biological level. I have critically read most of the publications by the Geier’s and I seriously doubt that Mr. Blaxill could shred this research even though he may think he could.

Boyd E. Haley, PhD
President

CTI Science, Inc.

Dr. Haley gave his permission to post the above email on Autism Investigated.

Mark Blaxill made these remarks in email to Attorney Mike Williams, lead petitioners’ attorney in the autism omnibus proceeding where Dr. Mark and David Geier were both expert witnesses for the petitioners. Eventually, the omnibus collapsed and 4,900 children were denied justice. Years after disparaging the Geiers’ work to Attorney Williams, Blaxill cited the fraudulent Danish research of international fugitive Poul Thorsen to defend thimerosal in email to omnibus petitioner and scientist Dr. Brian Hooker.

Today, history is repeating itself as Mark Blaxill continuously works to keep research fraud like Thorsen’s from being exposed before Congress and undermines the advocacy of Dr. Hooker. The Canary Party (founded and chaired by Blaxill) falsely led Dr. Hooker to believe that the organization would ask Congress to specifically pursue research misconduct like that committed by Thorsen. Canary Party’s apparent deception ultimately culminated in the indefinite collapse of the congressional autism hearings altogether.

Nonetheless, it is encouraging to learn that Mark Blaxill’s earlier attacks on Dr. Mark and David Geier are not sitting well with Dr. Boyd Haley.

Jake Crosby is editor of Autism Investigated and is diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder. He is a 2011 graduate of Brandeis University with a Bachelor of Arts in both History and Health: Science, Society and Policy and a 2013 graduate of The George Washington University School of Public Health and Health Services with a Master of Public Health in Epidemiology. He currently attends the University of Texas School of Public Health where he is studying for a Ph.D. in Epidemiology.

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70 Thoughts on “Dr. Boyd Haley: “I seriously doubt Mr. Blaxill could shred [the Geiers'] research”

  1. Letthembegot on December 17, 2013 at 12:02 pm said:

    Boyd Haley has remained true to this cause from the start.

    Glad to see he is standing firm.

  2. Lujene G. Clark, MA, LMT on December 17, 2013 at 12:04 pm said:

    I have such immense respect for Dr. Boyd Haley!! Thank you for this blog post, Jake. Keep up the good work.

  3. Yup, Dr Haley is one of the few people associated with autism who is trustworthy. He was also attacked by Dan Olmsted’s friend, Kathleen Seidel.

  4. White Rose on December 17, 2013 at 10:42 pm said:

    Professor Hayley is a true legend. Thank you for everything you have done .

  5. Doug Troutman on December 21, 2013 at 4:01 am said:

    I am glad to see a true scientist speak up in defense of Dr. Geier. MB, Olmstead and Siedel really put the screws to him. Dr. Haley always said the science was on our side but the politics of autism is not. He knows that the government agencies and industry are a revolving door. It is interesting that a so called vaccine attorney takes his advice from a person who is not a scientist such as Blaxil.

    • Of all the people to have taken advice from Blaxill over the years, probably one of the most shocking examples is Attorney Mike Williams. This is an experienced lawyer responsible for thousands of vaccine-injured cases, yet allows himself to be consulted on autism science by a non-scientist tied to the vaccine industry.

  6. White Rose on December 21, 2013 at 12:59 pm said:

    Radio silence from AoA ? Is that their decided policy (ignore all criticism – pretend it isn’t happening) , very reminiscent of the vaccine promoters !

    I once again call on Mark Blaxill to step down , to resign , from everything Vaccine-autism related .
    and for AoA to stop censoring the posts of parents who have difficult questions .

    • It wasn’t AoA’s decided policy last month when Dan Olmsted broke his six month-long excommunication of me by showing up in the comments here and complaining about AI’s coverage of the congressional hearing’s cancellation as it pertained to his blog. We also had a lively debate on Facebook that included his managing editor along with some Canary Party leaders. I guess he was not happy with how he represented himself as AoA has apparently reverted back to old habits of deafening silence, although he did trash me on his blog as a “web conspiracist” without naming me. How ironic he would even consider commenting here since any comment I submit to AoA won’t make it past moderation, but then again AI does not moderate out comments simply because of disagreements with commenters.

      I second your call, btw, but don’t count on it.

  7. White Rose on December 22, 2013 at 9:51 pm said:

    Question to all readers ? If Brian Hooker had appeared , like he should have done (thanks MarkB).
    Might it all be over now ? Ok , maybe I’m being overly optimistic but lets be clear on this .
    The Berlin Wall came down so quickly , & its in the just way that I expect this despicable UK\US conspiracy to collapse !

    Over on AoA they are still banging on about the disgusting “vaccine court” .You lot are a joke .

    Its way beyond that now , autistics number in the millions (never mind all the other vaccine damages) .
    Those with a full understanding have to realise this is about PROSECUTIONS .

    Jake – I’m not familiar with the Seidel \ OSR \ Olmsted saga …. would it be possible to bridge that gap ?

    AoA seems to be gatherings names and identities ….. that don’t like “anonymous” postings .
    Who are they collecting data for ?

    • I remember hearing Mark claim on Linderman that it is “just ludicrous” to say a historic opportunity to turn the ship around was missed at the 2012 hearing – the first congressional autism hearing with Dan Burton in a decade. I don’t know if “it would all be over now” had Brian been allowed to testify, but had he been allowed to, that hearing would have also been the first hearing where CDC’s buried 1999 evidence associating thimerosal with autism was exposed. It would have also been the first hearing where international fugitive Poul Thorsen’s scientific misconduct was exposed. We probably would have had a second hearing expanding on such malfeasance by now, but instead we’ve got no second hearing. Frankly, to say we didn’t miss a historic opportunity to turn the ship around is just ludicrous, as we’ve missed several. And if preventing that kind of turnaround was Blaxill’s objective, the last thing he wants people to think is that such opportunities even existed.

      As for Dr. Haley and OSR, here is an Op-Ed piece he wrote in a Kentucky newspaper in 2010.
      http://www.kentucky.com/2010/07/12/1345487/dietary-supplement-safe-for-right.html

      Though he doesn’t mention her, Seidel was leading neurodiversity’s charge against OSR – an anti-oxidant supplement Haley had developed which was taken by people with autism and met FDA’s supplement criteria as being “Generally Recognized as Safe”. Her campaign was taken up by a newspaper reporter-since-turned PR agent for pharma, leading the FDA to pressure him into voluntarily withdrawing OSR from the market.

      Ironically, AoA’s managing editor Kim Stagliano has raved about how OSR has helped her daughters. Had Seidel been successfully subpoenaed in 2008 without Olmsted and Kirby’s letter of interference, it is possible her spurious accusations would have never made it past her blog, that OSR would remain on pharmacy shelves and that it would still be taken by Stagliano’s daughters.

      I’m not aware of AoA gathering names and identities, enlighten me.

  8. White Rose on December 24, 2013 at 5:23 pm said:

    Merry Xmas & a happy new year to all here .
    We had a great 2012 , alas Pharma Harma had the better of 2013 in my view .
    Roll on 2014 . The fight goes on . Justice shall prevail .

    • 2012 was a year of blissful ignorance whereas 2013 was a year of hard lessons – they were not easy to learn, but I think we will all be better off because of them. Here’s to an enlightened new year.

  9. White Rose on December 27, 2013 at 7:10 pm said:

    Just watched this on You Tube .

    Geier & Geier: Autism, Mercury, Thimerosal & The VSD (2005)*

    & I’ve got to tell you Mark Blaxill , that I’m very impressed with the Geier’s .

    Smthg seems very wrong over at AoA-Canary .

  10. One of my main problems with the Geiers (on top of the practicing medicine without a license) is their need to chemically castrate autistic children….

    • Apart from the fact that an administrative law judge determined that the Maryland medical board’s charges of practicing unlicensed was completely unfounded – and that the board itself flouted fairness statutes for doctors according to the state legislature – the claim the Geiers “chemically castrate autistic children” is totally unfounded. The drug Dr. Geier prescribed may be used by law enforcement to chemically castrate sex offenders, but that’s not what he uses it for. It would be like saying everyone who uses a computer is a hacker because computers have been used to hack websites.

      • @Jake – so please enlighten us as to what else Lupron is used for? And the supporting “evidence” behind the Geier’s research utilizes temperatures that are 10x that of the human body – so please articulate what evidence actually supports their use of a chemical castration agent to treat autism?

        Luckily for the autism community at large, the Geiers are now unable to practice medicine anywhere in the United States….

        • As far as I know it is also used to treat prostate cancer and precocious puberty, the latter for which Dr. Geier used Lupron for. Before the Geiers even got interested in it, Dr. Haley had already shown that testosterone increased the percentage of brain cells killed by mercury exposure. So there would have to be a synergy between the two as testosterone alone did not kill any cells.

  11. @Jake – but Dr. Geier’s diagnoses of “precocious puberty” was found to be incorrect & only done to justify using a chemical castration agent as an autism treatment….and again, the “binding” of mercury and testosterone that the Geiers claimed to have found, occurred at temperatures several times what you would find in the human body (in a petri-dish, no less).

    No exactly Science…..

    • That’s only according to a medical board whose findings were disputed by an administrative law judge, whose own state legislature accused it of flouting fairness statutes for doctors, that did just that in justifying the suspension of Dr. Geier’s medical license and is now being sued by the Geiers themselves.

      The research I’m talking about was not done by the Geiers; I’m talking about research done by Dr. Haley independent of the Geiers before they were even involved with Lupron and done at normal temperatures.

  12. A very good summary of the Geiers can be found here:

    http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/?s=Geiers&submit=Search

    • Summaries by bloggers who, like Mark Blaxill, do not have the biological science and medical training of Dr. Mark and David Geier and who agree with Blaxill’s remarks about the Geiers’ work. IOW, not very good summaries of the Geiers at all.

    • What Happened to Kathleen Seidel’s character assassination where she frivolously claimed this chemical castration nonsense? How could you chemically castrate someone who had not yet reached puberty? Was Kathleen forced to remove her dishonest blog from the internet?

  13. White Rose on December 30, 2013 at 12:38 pm said:

    Happy New Year Larry (for tmrw) ….I hope the CDC xmas party was enjoyable

    Will you & LBRB give us your feedback on the 8 hepB Vaccine deaths in China please ?
    It was reported by just one mainstream newspaper here in the UK (all other news agencies manage a total blackout on the story) . Is it the usual lame excuse , that the vaccine was unrelated , and the demise of these unfortunate souls would have occurred anyway ?

    As for LBRB , it is a comedy website , that nobody goes to . Sullivan Carey is a criminal in my view .

    • Pharma front group chief Alison Singer and Matt Carey embellished his credentials when he was appointed to a US federal committee to make it look like he was a frequent contributor to more than just the LBRB blog – a blog neither registered in the US nor owned by a US citizen or business. He was hand-picked by Singer: http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/07/alison-singer-hand-picked-matt-carey-for-iacc-embellished-his-credentials.html

      • @Jake – and why should you care where a particular website is registered? I mean, the Internet is global & I even some typical web suffixes like .biz & .tv are actually registered out of foreign countries….why is it important, specifically, that LBRB be in any way affiliated with the US? I mean, isn’t John Stone from the UK? Why should he be allowed to post on US-related topics on AoA?

        As for what has happened in China, due to extremely lax regulatory oversight in China, there have been a whole host of problems stemming from the manufacture of just about everything from pharmaceuticals to dry wall…so laying the blame (before there is even a formal investigation) on anything more than sloppy manufacturing techniques is extremely premature.

        • Larry, the IACC is not a privately-owned website like Age of Autism; IACC is a federal committee of the US government. Members should be chosen based on their contributions here in the US, not for filling up blog space on a UK website.

          Also, I think your second paragraph should be directed at White Rose – not me.

        • Letthembegot on January 1, 2014 at 2:23 pm said:

          Larry – I hope you are getting well paid, otherwise its pee-ing in the wind I am afraid. The numbers, according to some experts, are now being estimated at 1 in 25 in USA. How will you continue to trot out the same old nonsense when the numbers grow beyond that.

          Your current job is at risk Larry with limited longevity – you should look at diversifying.
          Just a thought………… perhaps you could join the folks who still think smoking is ok – I know you missed the peak on that one but there are still some ill informed people out there to prey on surely ?

          Or there is the “Aspartame is good for you” brigade they are still recruiting ……………

          • Again, I ask by what criteria you are using to judge the current rates (or see what the DSM IV or V criteria would have done if applied back in the 1970s or 1980s)?

            Also, I would ask that you look into the diagnostic substitution that has taken place over the last 30 years – where kids with what would have been simple learning disabilities all the way up to “profound retardation” are now being classified as autistic.

            If you read the history books, you’ll discovery the sad story of how the mentally disabled (including people we would now consider autistic) were shuttered off by the tens of thousands into government-run or private institutions, not talked about in polite company & quite hidden away from everyone else.

            Up until recently, kids with disabilities weren’t even mainstreamed, but instead were kept in entirely separate schools (a knock against those that claim that they never saw these kids in school when they were growing up, hence they didn’t exist – precisely because those kids were kept out of school, sometimes entirely).

            Here is a good look at rates of mental retardation diagnoses from 1993:

            http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00040023.htm

            So, instead of attacking me with personal insults – perhaps you’d like to take the time to do some actual historical research, so you could add something to the conversation. Accusing one of being a “shill” is pretty much admitting that the one does not have an argument to begin with.

  14. @Jake – yes, the second comment was directed to White Rose.

    To clarify – is Matt Carey a US Citizen, living in the United States?

    Again, given that you, yourself, just stated that you have International Readers, does it matter one iota that Mr. Carey was posting blog posts on a website that just so happened to be registered in the UK? And if it does matter, why specifically does it?

    Back to the Geiers – it does seem that Blaxill’s opinion of the Geiers’ research has been borne out by the loss of Dr. Geiers’ medical licenses across the country – their participation in any hearings or Court cases would now do irrevocable harm to the plantiffs’ cases and certainly now have no standing to deliver evidence in a hearing. And we aren’t just talking about Maryland (where all of a sudden you now feel that a Court is able to rule on Science, when you and others have been adamant that Courts like the Vaccine Court should not be “ruling on Science.”) – so, if you’d care to follow up on all of those other states that took the time and effort to de-license Dr. Geier, I certainly would be interested to hear it.

    • He is, but the UK registration of his website still matters because that’s the sole basis for his appointment to a US federal committee.

      The other boards that yanked Dr. Geier’s license did so on the basis of the Maryland board, the problems of which I outlined in my earlier comment to you. My issue with vaccine court is not that it has been “ruling on the Science,” but that it shields vaccine manufacturers from litigation.

      • Happy new year :)

        He is, but the UK registration of his website still matters because that’s the sole basis for his appointment to a US federal committee.

        Do you have verifiable citations for that?

        Alain

        • Happy new year, Alain.

          Here’s what I do have:
          http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/07/matt-carey-replaces-kevin-leitch.html

          LBRB founder and likely still-owner Kevin Leitch writing me in 2012 and claiming quite angrily that LBRB is not a British blog and that Carey is the owner according to him. So apparently, the UK ownership of the site does matter to Kev.

          • Jake, You did not answer my question so I’ll reformulate: Do you have verifiable citation(s) that the IACC only considered Matt Carey’s blog posting at Left Brain Right Brain in order to appoint him on the IACC? What exactly the IACC did verify on him, his blog post or more informations?

            Alain

            • Here is Carey’s IACC bio when his appointment was announced:

              “Dr. Matthew Carey is the father of a young child with multiple disabilities, including autism spectrum disorder, and is a frequent contributor to the Left Brain/Right Brain blog and the Autism Science Foundation Blog. His writing focuses on reviewing current autism research in an understandable way for the public and he is deeply committed to communicating the importance of getting the science right for autism. He is also interested in analyzing trends in health and education public datasets. Dr. Carey is an active industrial researcher in computer hardware whose current research interests include magnetic thin films, spintronics, and magnetic nanostructures. He received his Ph.D. in Physics from the University of California, San Diego, and his M.S. in Physics from the University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign.” http://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2012pres/03/20120329a.html

              The only actual autism-related contributions mentioned here are to Leftbrain/Rightbrain and the Autism Science Foundation Blog, but the fact that he only made one contribution to the latter blog makes the claim that he was a “frequent contributor” to both false. So it was really his LBRB blogging that got him on the committee.

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  16. White Rose on December 31, 2013 at 3:12 pm said:

    Alain , are those the latest Thoresen like Autism statistics method tricks ?
    By changing the time zone (perhaps to Denmark) , you can massage the rate of Autism in New Jersey back from the present 1 in 25 , to a pre “mass vaccine madness” statistic of 1 in 10,000 ……

    If only Alain . There is only one way to roll back time on this disaster , and that is stop the vaccine holocaust.

    • Rose (white or whatever color your rose is),

      Why does timekeeping of a few hours has to matter in multi-year statistic? Can you explain that to me?

      Alain

      p.s. might want to matter why does a .uk domain matter more than any other domain in the world about appointment to the IACC.

  17. @White Rose – by what diagnostic criteria are you using to get the “1 in 10,000″ statistic? Because the criteria has changed numerous times, becoming more inclusive and covering a wider variety of symptoms…..not to mention that Jake’s diagnosis of Aspergers doesn’t even exist anymore – which I would assume just leaves him as a high-functioning Autistic?

    In the latest study out of Denmark, they found a total of around 750 Autistic children, out of a population of over 500,000 children studied (for over 7 years) – not exactly an avalanche of autism now, is it?

  18. Doug Troutman on January 2, 2014 at 1:51 am said:

    The Geiers have been attacked before the use of Lupron and Lupron can only be used if lab reports support it, Insurance companies will not pay for Lupron unless the patient is pre approved for its use. I think they were attacked by Maryland after they informed other nations that Thimerisol was being in their children’s shots. The other simply did not renew his license and I hope they win their lawsuits.

  19. @Doug – that was part of the problem. The Geiers were “mis-diagnosing” precocious puberty just so they could submit the children to their “Lupron Protocol.” Also, the Geiers were more than happy to accept “cash payments” for their various “treatments.”

    In fact, it sounds like you are more aware of the Lupron protocols than the Geiers were…..they were doing nothing less than performing medical experimentation on children without any basis in scientific fact.

    As to Dr. Geier losing his license – the facts speak for themselves & in most cases Dr. Geier didn’t even respond to the revocation process in several states (i.e. didn’t even defend himself).

    • …..they were doing nothing less than performing medical experimentation on children without any basis in scientific fact.

      *********

      Actually Larry, what you’ve described in the above quote is the childhood vaccination program.

  20. Doug Troutman on January 3, 2014 at 1:02 am said:

    Larry ,
    I must ask…How do you know that the Geier’s were “mis-diagnosing” precocious puberty? Honestly, your so called statements sound so familiar of those stated by those on “Neuro-diversity” and such. If the Geier’s actually accepted ‘cash payments’ how do you know and why does that even matter? I know personally there are MANY DAN! (as they once were called) providers that would ONLY accept cash payments and the Geier’s were one of the FEW providers that actually submitted to insurance for payment. I know this because they did this for us! Quite frankly, our son’s Endocrinologist prescribed Lupron for our son as well! My wife asked the Endocrinologist if this is something they do regularly for children with precocious puberty and the Endocrinologist replied that they did, neurotypical or not! So, apparently there IS science that is available for the use of this Lupron for precocious puberty! They were not and did not do anything out of the ordinary to treat it! Quite honestly, had we not seen the Geier’s for our son’s precocious puberty it would have been “untreated” and my wife would have never thought to had taken our son to our local Endocrinologist for further treatment!

    Perhaps you might spend more time in the actual science journals instead of spending and wasting your time reading the “Left-brain Right-brain” discussions.

  21. @Doug – what does “precocious puberty” have to do with autism?

    The Geiers themselves admitted that the only reason they utilized that diagnosis was to be allowed to prescribe Lupron as a treatment for autism. Dr. Geiers’ license was revoked in part because upon further investigation, his diagnosis of “precocious puberty” was incorrect, and done solely as a cover for using Lupron (and also, of course, using chelation when it was inappropriate).

    And allowing his brother, not a Doctor, diagnose and treat patients as well. Not exactly the most ethical gentlemen in America.

    Oh, and the other part where Dr. Geier attempted to get confidential patient information…not ethical either.

  22. @Doug – precocious puberty is a real diagnosis….if that’s what your son had, then yes, Lupron was a legitimate treatment. In the Geiers’ case, they used the diagnosis as an excuse – it had nothing to do with a legitimate diagnosis, it was only a smokescreen to perform their Lupron experiments on autistic children (with no evidence, mind you).

    I would recommend reading the actual charges leveled at the Geiers – it makes for very interesting reading.

  23. Doug Troutman on January 6, 2014 at 12:36 am said:

    Their is no ifs about it Larry, the endocrinologist confirmed the diagnosis the same way the Geiers did it. I have tried to educate you with our personal experience and you still want disseminate incorrect information. I have read the charges and they are inaccurate.

    • You are purposely misunderstanding – in your case, the diagnosis may have been correct. In many other cases, the diagnosis was incorrect & only done to allow for the use of Lupron to treat “autism” as theorized by the Geiers….without any supporting evidence.

      The case against the Geiers was correct – which is why Dr. Geiers’ license was suspended (across the country) and his brother was cited for practicing medicine without a license.

      • The ‘case’ against the Griers??

        In what court exactly was this ‘case’, brought against them, and by whom?

      • Doug Troutman on January 8, 2014 at 12:46 pm said:

        Larry, here is where you have your “Facts” incorrect. Dr. Geier does not have a “brother”. David Geier is his SON, not his brother. Another thing, due to the Maryland board “SUSPENDING” his license and the continued ongoing case…his license(s) across the country were simply not “re-newed” not suspended. There is a difference.

        Second, you continue to perpetuate this dis-information without the “facts”. Quite frankly…there is NO WAY the insurance companies would have paid for Lupron if there were no substantiated laboratory (medical proof of its use) reasoning for the use of this EXTREMELY expensive drug. You act as if he could just prescribe Lupron whenever he felt like it without medical necessity… YOU ARE WRONG!! It had to be proven necessary even with our son’s Endocrinologist before our insurance would cover most of it! Additionally, the drug is TOO expensive for those parents to just pay “out-of-pocket” for this drug to be used! Also, it was not to treat “autism” but the precocious puberty symptoms which included the aggression that goes along with a substantial increase of testosterone in individuals who happened to have “autism”. Parents like myself sought out help for our child who was developing at an extremely fast rate and showing physical signs of puberty way before they were of the age to be going through puberty.

        Where are your facts regarding; “in many other cases, the diagnosis was incorrect & only done to allow for the use of Lupron”? Please provide a link/website where it shows the public records of your alleged claims. Otherwise, you are only continue to spew out defamatory misinformation without substantiated evidence.

        It appears Larry, you do not have the facts straight and that you PURPOSELY are MISUNDERSTANDING those that are being spoon-fed to you here on this Blog. I have more important things to do besides trying to correct your ludicrous defamatory claims against Dr. Geier and his son (not brother as you continue to state incorrectly), David Geier. The truth is that as mentioned by Jake, the Maryland Medical Board went after them ONLY after they were getting WORLD wide press regarding the need to remove mercury/Thimerosal from the vaccines or not using those vaccines with that preservative in them by the World Health Organization (WHO). There was no other reason.

        I’m sure the Geier’s are not just sitting back without taking up a lawsuit against the Maryland’s Medical Board. I would not be surprised if they are already doing so…and rightly so, I might add. The so-called claims were never substantiated in any “court”.

        This continued back-and-forth with you is nothing but a “waste of my time”, but hopefully with this, my last response to your purposeful misinformation, I might have enlighten readers to your erroneous statements and how you obviously are just spewing out the continued misinformation and how you never give the reader any credible source for your misinformation.
        Have a great day Larry.

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